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11 months post H Pylori Eradication

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Polaris
Posts: 3
Joined: Tue Apr 12, 2022 1:05 pm

11 months post H Pylori Eradication

Post by Polaris »

Hello Helico_expert,

Background:
I was diagnosed with H Pylori in March 2021 due to my dyspesia, fullness and weight loss that turned into back and stomach burning. I was scared of treatment and I waited until end of April to do the treatment. I finished treatment and waited to retest breath in August which was NEGATIVE (#1). My symptoms improved slowly those months, however I still had burning so I managed with pepsid for all of those months until Oct when pepcid stopped working, so I took Omeprazole until February this year as I weaned off and dealt with some rebound with Pepcid.

To shorten things, I had a NEGATIVE (#2) biopsy in December 2021, 7 months after treatment but I was on the ppi. They said it wouldn't affect the biopsy result. My stomach and duodenum were clear of visible inflammation, but biopsy said MILD CHRONIC GASTRITIS, Negative Pylori (alcian yellow stain) and negative for metaplasia (alcian blue stain). My symptoms have slowly improved even after wean but there is this persistent back tingling or warmth discomfort that has very, very slowly decreased up until now, even coming off pepcid 11 months after treatment. I have to eat only bland or otherwise the stinging in my upper stomach and back intensifies. This is my issue-- I still feel that inflammation in the upper region of my stomach. I just went in for a second breath test March 2022, a week off pepcid, antacids or bismuth or herbs, and it came back NEGATIVE (#3) as well.

Question:
So my question is- Can pylori colonies hide or only centralize in the Cardia/Fundus of the stomach? To the point where it hides from and is missed by the standard body/antrum sample biopsy, including the urea liquid form a second breath test? I understand it breaks down the urea we drink, but could it be so hidden or out of range in the upper stomach that the drink liquid does not even reach the bacteria to begin breakdown and assess an accurate reading? I am on the verge of asking for a second treatment and do a stool test in case they keep missing it. What is your insight on the response of the bacteria to a situation like this? Does it explicitly always react with any urea test drink in the stomach, even that which is out of range or maybe acid that is out of it's colony space? I am also inclined to demand a biopsy of those other parts of the stomach because the hardly, real slow improvement has me worried and not healing. :(

Thank you so much for taking the time and answering all of our questions and concerns over this awful little creature. I appreciate all your help.

CatherineA10
Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Mar 16, 2022 6:39 am

Re: 11 months post H Pylori Eradication

Post by CatherineA10 »

I know how you feel. I am 4 weeks post antibiotics and feel so much worse then before the antibiotics.Am on a Very restricted low PH diet and if I don’t follow it completely my stomach will kick off for days , even following it only gives me minimum relief. I too was told I had mild chronic gastritis but am not sure that means anything.
Maybe helico_expert can tell us if mild chronic gastritis is common in people with no symptoms as I read that 80% of people have this and a specialist doesn’t really think finding this on endoscopy is anything remarkable. I had that and a very red inflammation top of stomach which is a typical to h plyroi.
Will be retesting in 1.5 weeks so will see if it is h Plyroi or left over damage or post viral ibs which my specialist thinks it is.

Helico_expert
Site Admin
Posts: 4600
Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2011 7:20 am

Re: 11 months post H Pylori Eradication

Post by Helico_expert »

yea, it's always an interest for us when we see non h. pylori related gastritis. Because to date, only H. pylori can survive in the stomach. So what else could be causing the inflammation?
PPI will affect histology detection of H. pylori. But since you had multiple breath test, it should be accurate enough. Most importantly, I think is the histology report about you not having intestinal metaplasia.

I think some gastritis may be caused by the acid itself. Perhaps your mucus secretion is weakened by H. pylori. That will probably take a long time to heal.

anyway, since you are repeating a breath test soon, try to get the raw value of the breath test. How negative is negative. If the cut off value is 50 dpm and you got 49 dpm, then it is suspicious negative. If you got 1 dpm, then this is very negative and is trustable.

Polaris
Posts: 3
Joined: Tue Apr 12, 2022 1:05 pm

Re: 11 months post H Pylori Eradication

Post by Polaris »

Thank you for getting back to me. Yeah, I do not know what is causing continuous inflammation. That is the real mystery to me. I do have my doubts on the multiple tests. I saw that the Breath ID machine read my DOB as 0.6 in August and 0.0 this March. I suppose it did not detect any load with my comparing of my breath samples. Is there any documentation or information about Pylori not reacting with the urea that is ingested? That is really my concern, that it is not encountering it or reacting with it as it may be just hiding out of the way, and the solution does not reach the hidden colony at the very top. That is my only confusion about this bacteria. Hopefully the stool test detects it once and for all if it is alive in me and shedding antigens.

Or it could mean what you said, that creature weakened my stomach cells to the point where they do not want to produce enough mucous to coat. That would absolutely suck if they do not repair to normal. I have been feeling a little better, but its not normal. So I stay within strict dietary bounds to avoid acid irritation.

CatherineA10
Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Mar 16, 2022 6:39 am

Re: 11 months post H Pylori Eradication

Post by CatherineA10 »

Have you tried any medications? I saw this one mentioned in gastric healing book Mucosta? Also maybe an old style anti depressant like amitriptyline for nerve damage.

Helico_expert
Site Admin
Posts: 4600
Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2011 7:20 am

Re: 11 months post H Pylori Eradication

Post by Helico_expert »

yea.. perhaps we can rethink the whole situation.
first of all, many people carry H. pylori without symptoms.
Therefore, H. pylori infection doesnt always produce symptoms.

Also, in a small group of people, the outcome of H. pylori infection is low acid secretion. Then these people also have very little to no symptoms. So acid is probably the main agent that causes symptoms.

So when the damage by H. pylori is accumulated enough, then perhaps the mucus is reduced, the acid is burning the stomach, and you feel the burn or pain. If that is true, PPI should do the trick.

Also, when your mucus is reduced, for example when you took too much NSAIDs (such as aspirin), the acid can give the same burning and pain symptom, including ulcer.

your DOB reading is very good. I believe you are free of H. pylori now. You can focus on your symptomatic treatment. Hopefully you will gradually recover.

AMERC
Posts: 111
Joined: Mon Dec 07, 2020 5:23 am

Re: 11 months post H Pylori Eradication

Post by AMERC »

"I think some gastritis may be caused by the acid itself. Perhaps your mucus secretion is weakened by H. pylori. That will probably take a long time to heal."

Hi HelicoExpert

Is there anything that can be done to repair the damage caused by H Pylori such as mucus secretion?

Helico_expert
Site Admin
Posts: 4600
Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2011 7:20 am

Re: 11 months post H Pylori Eradication

Post by Helico_expert »

great question!
at the moment is none.
perhaps tissue grafting may help. It's still under research at the moment.

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